So ACN have announced another 600 redundancies today. Discuss.

Hardly surprising to be fair - I honestly have to say that I'm not bothered if I stay or get shown the door - both are good options for me at the moment.... we shall wait and see.

Uncle thomlinson just annouced 600 to go from consulting and solutions.this will be concluded by either by 1st May or by 1st July (my gutfeeling!)Guys any gutfeeling what will be the VR/CR package this time??and BTW howz job market, is it worth taking VR at this time....regds

I believe the VR package should be the same. There could be potential legal implications if there is significant difference? Any legal experts out there?

If you would have read the QA document on the sharepoint you will see it says this will be done by June.

How many people, in total, work in the areas targeted for redundancy? I'm trying to work out what percentage of employees will get the axe.Also, do people think they'll wait for the outcome of year end reviews (May / June) to make final decisions given that last time performance review ratings effected the decision.

Management really got it wrong this time.... They mentioned that there appeared to be a softening as they were closing last year's round... but the ECF said we shouldn't take it in to account when offered the chance to increase the numbers... struggle to see the logic for that, now more disruption and uncertainty for something that most people could have predictedCan't understand why 3 months is needed again to repeat what we did 5 months ago either ??? Short and quick process and get it over and done with!Morale is really rock bottom now...if it wasn't before after the promotion round - why did we even bother having one.

so lots of cuts over the past 6 months, exactly how may SEs have been asked to leave?????

I'm wondering if they will offer sabbaticals or flex-leave this time round as some of the other firms have done (ie. take x months leave with 30% salary). That problem a lot of consultancy firms faced in the 2001 tech crash was not having enough resources when the economy picked up again after cutting their workforce.

Management cocked it up last time around by offering VR. What happened was that anyone who was half decent took VR and have now gone away with a nice pay out and most likely had a job lined up before they actually left.This time around I would be very suprised if they open it to Volunteers, instead they will get rid of the people who they should have got rid of first time around in addition to those people who are perpetually on the bench in the firm.

what one should be doing in order to get short-listed in the 'to go' list ? given the current morale, getting 4-6 salaries and go home would't be a bad idea at all... I understand that the package is calculated gross-based but net paid up to £30k that that would give more or less until end of the year to find an other job, when btw hopefully economic will be better.

Last VR round, Accenture REJECTED applications from the Top rated people so they DID NOT lose their best people - they're not completley stupid!! All those that were Consistent, Below and probably some Above applications were successful. Any redundancy pay under £30 is Tax free.

Out of 600 jobs how do you reckon it will cascade down in terms of numbers? Between MCIM & Solutions. Between specific service lines and OGs.

anon, great answer. but if one would be well rated within their range, any idea on how to nicely force to be offered the VR?

Aim to spend lot of time on the bench and most likely you will be counseled out....

hi guys, good points raised. but here it is one situation. joint the firm 12 months ago as a M, been chargeable for 9 non-stop months, but since Jan the economic is horrible and i cant get a next role. plenty of people like me sitting on the bench for 12-16 weeks and the size of the bench is to increase... no projects in the short-horizon (4-6 weeks)... someone mentioned that a way to get out is to stay long on the bench and they will kick you out... but in this new scenario, how long is 'stay longer' on the bench ? and what to expect in terms of salaries for councelling out ?

"Counselling out" is different from redundancy.It's when you're given the choice between resigning in a dignified fashion vs. being put on a "performance improvement plan" then being fired when you fail to meet it.The counselling takes the form of helping you see that the rational choice is to resign and leave on a relatively positive note, with your pride, reputation and network intact. An extra month's pay whilst you cling on desperately isn't generally worth it.

Do you get the same sort of package to be counselled out?

No, you either resign or are fired, so redundancy terms do not apply.

Even if you get fired as long as is not for anything bad like then they will have to give you the redundancy package mr four seasons

so for example, if you are counselled out due to lack of chargeability but your performance in general on projects is fine, you can get around £12K as an analyst/£16K as a consultant?

The definition of "fired" is involuntary performance-based termination. It is non-voluntary, non-redundancy, non-retirement. There are no good reasons for being fired - by definition, all are "bad" and therefore ineligible for redundancy-style payouts......unless you're FTSE 100 chief exec :-)

to the chap who wrote:"Last VR round, Accenture REJECTED applications from the Top rated people so they DID NOT lose their best people - they're not completley stupid!! All those that were Consistent, Below and probably some Above applications were successful. Any redundancy pay under £30 is Tax free."Factually, you are incorrect. They did allow a large number of top rated candidates leave, I know this for a fact. I know a significant number of other people who also had at the top or sig above ratings who also had their applications for VR accepted. I'm not sure who you speak to in the business, but if you speak openly with any senior SE's they will admit that they lost too many good people in the last round of VR and CR's....also, your comment about ANY pay out under £30k being tax free is incorrect, you need to look at the detail of the arrangement of the redundancy package as you will find that most people will have to pay tax on a proportion of the pay out.... its all on the calculator that they sent out.

If you get councilled out you get paid off ! Councilling out is actually illegal so they payment you receive is based on what you would receive at a tribunal. Its roughly the same as the VR offer !

I would doubt if anyone will be getting councilled out anytime soon. I think all of those people left before the VR round.Not sure what the impact of the mid-year would be but no-one with 'very top' will be getting councilled out.Also, Being councilled out is not being 'fired' it is reaching whats called a 'Compromise Agreement' and takes the form if 'I agree to walkaway without prejudice for £x amount of money'I would also presume that the 2nd round redundancies are generally CR not VR.But don't listen to me I took VR last time round ! HAHA

"Counselling out" only leads to compromise agreements in a tiny proportion of cases where somebody is so bad/has such a corrosive influence that the firm can't afford to wait for the performance improvement and dismissal process to run its course. Counselling out is used when there is a clear reason of performance or competence to remove staff. Redundancy is used where staff performance is acceptable but business circumstances dictate a reduction in force, and it is also a convenient time to get rid of staff where it is too difficult to conclusively prove incompetence/dishonesty.

ACN uses the 'compromise agreement' in almost all circumstances of being councilled out and almost all staff being councilled out receive a payment as they have grounds for 'unfair dismissal' as the due process has been side-stepped.Anyway, It is probably not relevant here as the firm is using the redundancy process, Of which I would imagine most to be CR.For those people who received 'at the top' in your mid-years I can understand you being pissed off but you are unlikely to at the top of the CR list I'm afraid, The forced distribution model means there are people out there who got CW, A and even below !